Comments on: The Lie of Star Wars as Entertainment http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/ DEVISING A SYSTEM FOR REMEMBERING EVERYTHING Sun, 21 Mar 2010 06:49:45 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 By: Nargel http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-157624 Nargel Sat, 08 Aug 2009 08:15:02 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-157624 As was mentioned above, Lucas' stated intention when Ep. IV was done was to recreate the Sunday afternoon action serials that he enjoyed as a kid. Not art for the ages. Needing to accept the input from others as a prerequisite to getting funding for the next 2 kept the 'Art for the Ages' impulse under control. It also kept the fun factor somewhat in mind. The prequels not so much. I think John's right. It all became about self-deluded 'Art for the Ages' and simple fun became third or fourth in importance. Lametude takes over and fun vanishes. As far as the Matrix sidebar is concerned, there are several places in the second film where elements are buried that, I believe, were supposed to be revealed (in retrospect) in the third film as clues to what was really going on. I believe the moneymen forced a major rewrite of the third film because they saw it as too cerebral and not enough action. They also seem to have assumed that the audience would not have been able to understand the concept of the Matrix world having (at least) three levels. The spoonbender koan, the ability of Neo to shut down the mechs (limited timeframe or not) and other issues look pretty solid as lead-ins to the concept of the Zion level as being another Matrix level between the already known Matrix level and 'reality'. Agent Smith would have been perfectly placed to spot the Zion level's true nature and disclose this to Neo. If they had been able to film the story they were aiming at beyond the second film rather than the compromise they were forced to film, I believe, the series would have had a much better finish. As was mentioned above, Lucas’ stated intention when Ep. IV was done was to recreate the Sunday afternoon action serials that he enjoyed as a kid. Not art for the ages. Needing to accept the input from others as a prerequisite to getting funding for the next 2 kept the ‘Art for the Ages’ impulse under control. It also kept the fun factor somewhat in mind.

The prequels not so much. I think John’s right. It all became about self-deluded ‘Art for the Ages’ and simple fun became third or fourth in importance. Lametude takes over and fun vanishes.

As far as the Matrix sidebar is concerned, there are several places in the second film where elements are buried that, I believe, were supposed to be revealed (in retrospect) in the third film as clues to what was really going on. I believe the moneymen forced a major rewrite of the third film because they saw it as too cerebral and not enough action. They also seem to have assumed that the audience would not have been able to understand the concept of the Matrix world having (at least) three levels. The spoonbender koan, the ability of Neo to shut down the mechs (limited timeframe or not) and other issues look pretty solid as lead-ins to the concept of the Zion level as being another Matrix level between the already known Matrix level and ‘reality’. Agent Smith would have been perfectly placed to spot the Zion level’s true nature and disclose this to Neo.

If they had been able to film the story they were aiming at beyond the second film rather than the compromise they were forced to film, I believe, the series would have had a much better finish.

]]> By: mzmadmike http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-130520 mzmadmike Sat, 21 Feb 2009 17:28:32 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-130520 ICE PIRATES! ;-) ICE PIRATES!

;-)

]]> By: John B http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90151 John B Tue, 03 Apr 2007 19:09:38 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90151 I agree with Kristine Kathryn Rusch's essay if you ignore what the original Star Wars series actually was (stilted dialogue, black and white plots, etc.) and focus on what they represented in the popular culture. They were(in theory)fun adventures that wanted to sweep you up and entertain you. That's what people think of when they think of those old movies- lightsabers and spaceships. Rusch's point is that sf needs to entertain more than it has been doing lately. If her sales numbers are correct, and I have no reason to doubt her, the one thing sf hasn't been doing is entertaining people. I agree with Kristine Kathryn Rusch’s essay if you ignore what the original Star Wars series actually was (stilted dialogue, black and white plots, etc.) and focus on what they represented in the popular culture.

They were(in theory)fun adventures that wanted to sweep you up and entertain you. That’s what people think of when they think of those old movies- lightsabers and spaceships.

Rusch’s point is that sf needs to entertain more than it has been doing lately. If her sales numbers are correct, and I have no reason to doubt her, the one thing sf hasn’t been doing is entertaining people.

]]> By: Kolt http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90150 Kolt Sun, 18 Mar 2007 12:48:58 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90150 ......? ……?

]]> By: John Scalzi http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90149 John Scalzi Thu, 08 Feb 2007 04:41:17 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90149 And that comment has all the hallmarks of someone with their head deeply wedged into their duodenum. You <i>must</i> be proud. And that comment has all the hallmarks of someone with their head deeply wedged into their duodenum. You must be proud.

]]> By: Johnny Cash http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90147 Johnny Cash Thu, 08 Feb 2007 04:38:57 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90147 Heh... this article has the hallmarks of a bitter person who has no idea what they want to do with their life and time! Heh… this article has the hallmarks of a bitter person who has no idea what they want to do with their life and time!

]]> By: John Scalzi http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90146 John Scalzi Tue, 02 Jan 2007 01:32:36 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90146 Matt: "Why even anylize this, they are movies." That's just about the most ignorant and moronic thing anyone's said in this entire thread, Matt. Thanks ever so much for sharing it. Now, please take your willful obliviousness somewhere else. Matt:

“Why even anylize this, they are movies.”

That’s just about the most ignorant and moronic thing anyone’s said in this entire thread, Matt. Thanks ever so much for sharing it. Now, please take your willful obliviousness somewhere else.

]]> By: Matt http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90145 Matt Tue, 02 Jan 2007 01:24:34 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90145 Way too much cynism here. It's science "fiction". We arent supposed to be part of the story, we are being told the story. I personally felt it(episode IV) to be very entertaining. It was dramatic,suspensful and funny. Harrison was great as the anti-hero.With many one liners and monologues that make the regular person laugh. When Luke kills the tie fighter from the falcons anti-air guns he gets very excited. Solo's response "great kid now dont get cocky!" was awesome. WHy even anylize this, they are movies.I guess the owner of this site has a major dislike for everything Lucas. Way too much cynism here.
It’s science “fiction”. We arent supposed to be part of the story, we are being told the story.
I personally felt it(episode IV) to be very entertaining. It was dramatic,suspensful and funny. Harrison was great as the anti-hero.With many one liners and monologues that make the regular person laugh. When Luke kills the tie fighter from the falcons anti-air guns he gets very excited. Solo’s response “great kid now dont get cocky!” was awesome.
WHy even anylize this, they are movies.I guess the owner of this site has a major dislike for everything Lucas.

]]> By: jim http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90144 jim Mon, 25 Dec 2006 17:17:36 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90144 It's really hard to come to come to grips with the fact that Lucas totally fucked up the SW franchise with those prequels. What a complete cluster fuck. I mean almost every level of those movies is a disaster: dialogue, acting, character development, plot, not to mention the cheesy CG FX that are already looking dated. My pet theory is that Lucas is really just a glorified FX junkie who's just infatuated with the CG effects. The movies were really just a platform for implementing new computer effects for industrial light and magic. How many fuckin times is he going to re-release the films with super-duper new effects? Even though Spielberg fell prey to this same bullshit when he released E.T. on DVD with cheese digital CG, he at least had the wisdom to release the original version without any tampering on a separate disk. Jim (just another pissed off SW fan) It’s really hard to come to come to grips with the fact that Lucas totally fucked up the SW franchise with those prequels. What a complete cluster fuck. I mean almost every level of those movies is a disaster: dialogue, acting, character development, plot, not to mention the cheesy CG FX that are already looking dated.

My pet theory is that Lucas is really just a glorified FX junkie who’s just infatuated with the CG effects. The movies were really just a platform for implementing new computer effects for industrial light and magic. How many fuckin times is he going to re-release the films with super-duper new effects? Even though Spielberg fell prey to this same bullshit when he released E.T. on DVD with cheese digital CG, he at least had the wisdom to release the original version without any tampering on a separate disk.

Jim
(just another pissed off SW fan)

]]> By: joseph_king http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90143 joseph_king Sun, 10 Dec 2006 00:38:27 +0000 http://whatever.scalzi.com/2006/10/11/the-lie-of-star-wars-as-entertainment/#comment-90143 Referring to starwars episode IV, im not entirely convinced that luke did say 'clone wars'. It also sounds like 'colonial wars' to me. Lucas has used the starwars fan base to create his mythology since then. As for prequels, it seems apparent to me that he has placed more on the fan created starwars mythology to create the films than existing earth mytholgies and cultures. This has created a far more fabricated feel than the original movies, which appeared to relie more on the existing mythologies that are already imbeded in our social conciousness. The prequels relate to hardened fans. Referring to starwars episode IV, im not entirely convinced that luke did say ‘clone wars’. It also sounds like ‘colonial wars’ to me. Lucas has used the starwars fan base to create his mythology since then.
As for prequels, it seems apparent to me that he has placed more on the fan created starwars mythology to create the films than existing earth mytholgies and cultures. This has created a far more fabricated feel than the original movies, which appeared to relie more on the existing mythologies that are already imbeded in our social conciousness. The prequels relate to hardened fans.

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