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	<title>Comments on: Quick Watchmen Review</title>
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	<description>I FORGET WHAT EIGHT WAS FOR</description>
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		<title>By: BethanyAnne</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-136150</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[BethanyAnne]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:59:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-136150</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I saw it in IMAX with a friend, and loved it.  My main gripe at the time was that I had forgotten my earplugs, and felt like the theatre was actively *trying* to deafen me.

This was my first exposure to the story - no books, and didn&#039;t even see all of the trailer.  For me, the pacing felt really good.  I thought that there were several irons in the fire, and that the director was doing a good job of moving them all along.  I didn&#039;t get bored, or particularly see where it was headed.

The one thing that pissed me off was killing the gay girls.  It looked like the writer or director was saying something to the effect of &quot;Hey, we still have the problems you know&quot;. I could see how it made sense to have it in the story contextually.  But I just get frustrated that so many times writers seem to feel the need to kill a gay girl or black guy in their stories.  Hrrrw.  I guess it&#039;s a soapbox thing for me, so I&#039;ll step down, but damn, it&#039;s annoying.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I saw it in IMAX with a friend, and loved it.  My main gripe at the time was that I had forgotten my earplugs, and felt like the theatre was actively *trying* to deafen me.</p>
<p>This was my first exposure to the story &#8211; no books, and didn&#8217;t even see all of the trailer.  For me, the pacing felt really good.  I thought that there were several irons in the fire, and that the director was doing a good job of moving them all along.  I didn&#8217;t get bored, or particularly see where it was headed.</p>
<p>The one thing that pissed me off was killing the gay girls.  It looked like the writer or director was saying something to the effect of &#8220;Hey, we still have the problems you know&#8221;. I could see how it made sense to have it in the story contextually.  But I just get frustrated that so many times writers seem to feel the need to kill a gay girl or black guy in their stories.  Hrrrw.  I guess it&#8217;s a soapbox thing for me, so I&#8217;ll step down, but damn, it&#8217;s annoying.</p>
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		<title>By: JJ Brannon</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-134552</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[JJ Brannon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 03:47:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-134552</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Oh, and as to the frostbite contention...

I started kindergarten in Fairbanks, Alaska [at the edge of the Arctic Circle], and lived there until the summer between first and second grades.  I used to play outside in -60°F.

It&#039;s quite possible to walk the distance Rorschach did near the middle of spring [1 Nov 1985] in Antarctica near the continental perimeter [which for most of the continent is the Antarctic Circle] with a trenchcoat, gloves, facemask, and hat.

Ever hear about the &quot;100 Club&quot;?

To join is simple.  Be at McMurdo Station in Antarctica.  Step from a 100°F sauna into -100°F winter and race the 100 yards to the flagpole and back.

Naked.

Sometimes referred to as the &quot;200 Club&quot; for the differential and total distance.


JJB]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, and as to the frostbite contention&#8230;</p>
<p>I started kindergarten in Fairbanks, Alaska [at the edge of the Arctic Circle], and lived there until the summer between first and second grades.  I used to play outside in -60°F.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s quite possible to walk the distance Rorschach did near the middle of spring [1 Nov 1985] in Antarctica near the continental perimeter [which for most of the continent is the Antarctic Circle] with a trenchcoat, gloves, facemask, and hat.</p>
<p>Ever hear about the &#8220;100 Club&#8221;?</p>
<p>To join is simple.  Be at McMurdo Station in Antarctica.  Step from a 100°F sauna into -100°F winter and race the 100 yards to the flagpole and back.</p>
<p>Naked.</p>
<p>Sometimes referred to as the &#8220;200 Club&#8221; for the differential and total distance.</p>
<p>JJB</p>
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		<title>By: JJ Brannon</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-134537</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[JJ Brannon]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 02:43:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-134537</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[By the way, Rorschach can&#039;t dispatch the child-killer in the same manner as he did in the novel: Moore lifted that from &lt;i&gt;Mad Max&lt;/i&gt;.

This was better, I felt.  One better experienced Rorschach&#039;s pain, frustration, and righteous anger.


JJB]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way, Rorschach can&#8217;t dispatch the child-killer in the same manner as he did in the novel: Moore lifted that from <i>Mad Max</i>.</p>
<p>This was better, I felt.  One better experienced Rorschach&#8217;s pain, frustration, and righteous anger.</p>
<p>JJB</p>
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		<title>By: John Scalzi</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-134432</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[John Scalzi]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 22:32:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-134432</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think you are all a little &lt;i&gt;involved&lt;/i&gt; in Dr. Manhattan&#039;s package.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you are all a little <i>involved</i> in Dr. Manhattan&#8217;s package.</p>
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		<title>By: Rodney Graves</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-134431</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Rodney Graves]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 22:26:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-134431</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[garret responded (to my question concerning Dr. Manhatten&#039;s missing testes):

&lt;blockquote&gt;They are there, it’s just that the penis is so wide and long and luminescent that you can not see them.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Are you claiming you used X-Ray vision on Dr. Manhattan&#039;s package?

Really?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>garret responded (to my question concerning Dr. Manhatten&#8217;s missing testes):</p>
<blockquote><p>They are there, it’s just that the penis is so wide and long and luminescent that you can not see them.</p></blockquote>
<p>Are you claiming you used X-Ray vision on Dr. Manhattan&#8217;s package?</p>
<p>Really?</p>
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		<title>By: garrett</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-134427</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[garrett]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 22:19:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-134427</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[RE: Dr. Manhattan&#039;s testicles.

They are there, it&#039;s just that the penis is so wide and long and luminescent that you can not see them.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RE: Dr. Manhattan&#8217;s testicles.</p>
<p>They are there, it&#8217;s just that the penis is so wide and long and luminescent that you can not see them.</p>
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		<title>By: submandave</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-134286</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[submandave]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:43:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-134286</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Joel @ 75: You hit on something I have had bouncing about in my skull, too.  For those of us in our 40&#039;s themes such as nuclear war and the Soviet threat need no explanation, btu for much of the younger audience the emotional package that comes with just the idea just isn&#039;t there.  For them, the idea of global nuclear annihilation feels to be no more a real threat than alien invasion.  I wonderto what degree this disconnect informs many viewers&#039; opinions.

As to Moore/Miller, the main difference I see is that Alan&#039;s works are very much in-the-moment comments on the contemporary world.  &quot;Watchmen&quot; was so powerful and effective when it was published because it reflected a world and reality that was close to our personal experiences.  It is only natural that this would make it less so as a piece of retrospective.  Frank, on the other hand, tends to focus not on contemporary situation but rather to more directly address underlying universal themes, often within a conciously retro context.  Regardless of when it is supposed to have happened, &quot;Sin City&quot; belongs more the noir world of the &#039;30s than anything modern.  Even his ostensibly future-set works, such as &quot;Dark Knight,&quot; are infused with retro elements.  This timelessness makes it easier to project dates material into the present.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joel @ 75: You hit on something I have had bouncing about in my skull, too.  For those of us in our 40&#8242;s themes such as nuclear war and the Soviet threat need no explanation, btu for much of the younger audience the emotional package that comes with just the idea just isn&#8217;t there.  For them, the idea of global nuclear annihilation feels to be no more a real threat than alien invasion.  I wonderto what degree this disconnect informs many viewers&#8217; opinions.</p>
<p>As to Moore/Miller, the main difference I see is that Alan&#8217;s works are very much in-the-moment comments on the contemporary world.  &#8220;Watchmen&#8221; was so powerful and effective when it was published because it reflected a world and reality that was close to our personal experiences.  It is only natural that this would make it less so as a piece of retrospective.  Frank, on the other hand, tends to focus not on contemporary situation but rather to more directly address underlying universal themes, often within a conciously retro context.  Regardless of when it is supposed to have happened, &#8220;Sin City&#8221; belongs more the noir world of the &#8217;30s than anything modern.  Even his ostensibly future-set works, such as &#8220;Dark Knight,&#8221; are infused with retro elements.  This timelessness makes it easier to project dates material into the present.</p>
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		<title>By: submandave</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-134252</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[submandave]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:27:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-134252</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Catherine @ 20:  Without giving too much away, the concerns I&#039;d have with a younger person viewing Watchmen would include:

- The afore mentioned sex scene, which I would say is a hard &quot;R&quot; (e.g. we see Dan&#039;s naked buttox thrusting betwixt Laurie&#039;s thighs from the side).

- A murdered girl&#039;s body is fed to dogs.  While neither the murder nor the feeding is directly shown, the idea and way it is presented is quite disturbing.

- Lots of graphic violence, including dismemberment and meat cleavers to the head.  The chief way in which Dr. Manhattan dispatches foes is by literally exploding their bodies, including flying viscera and various parts dripping from ceiling and walls, etc.

- Some people might be concerned about the big blue glowing radioactive penis that shares many of the scenes with Dr. Manhattan.  Yes, he&#039;s post-human and generally minor things like clothes are not important enough to capture his attention.  My guess is that your son has already seen at least one of those and shold not be shocked to find that other fellows have one as well, but if he is like most kids (and adults for that matter) he&#039;ll get a few chuckles from seeing it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Catherine @ 20:  Without giving too much away, the concerns I&#8217;d have with a younger person viewing Watchmen would include:</p>
<p>- The afore mentioned sex scene, which I would say is a hard &#8220;R&#8221; (e.g. we see Dan&#8217;s naked buttox thrusting betwixt Laurie&#8217;s thighs from the side).</p>
<p>- A murdered girl&#8217;s body is fed to dogs.  While neither the murder nor the feeding is directly shown, the idea and way it is presented is quite disturbing.</p>
<p>- Lots of graphic violence, including dismemberment and meat cleavers to the head.  The chief way in which Dr. Manhattan dispatches foes is by literally exploding their bodies, including flying viscera and various parts dripping from ceiling and walls, etc.</p>
<p>- Some people might be concerned about the big blue glowing radioactive penis that shares many of the scenes with Dr. Manhattan.  Yes, he&#8217;s post-human and generally minor things like clothes are not important enough to capture his attention.  My guess is that your son has already seen at least one of those and shold not be shocked to find that other fellows have one as well, but if he is like most kids (and adults for that matter) he&#8217;ll get a few chuckles from seeing it.</p>
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		<title>By: Rodney Graves</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-134179</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Rodney Graves]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 05:51:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-134179</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[garrett,

1.  RE the Graphic Violence: That was Rorschach&#039;s defining moment.  He (correctly) concluded that that perpetrator would indeed be found &quot;insane&quot; by the &quot;criminal justice&quot; system, and treated vice punished.  Rorschach deemed that punishment was the appropriate outcome, and provided same.  He made his choice, and then consistently stuck with it; judging those he encountered on their own merits and faults, thus the antithesis of Ozymandius.

2.  In RE Dr. Manhattan&#039;s package: Do you concur with my notice of the missing testicles and their symbology?

3.  What didn&#039;t make the Movie (all y&#039;all please chime in):

.1)  The &lt;i&gt;Black Freighter&lt;/i&gt; Comic within the Graphic Novel (in which the protagonist becomes the evil he sought to overcome).

.2)  Mind Bending Squid from Outer Space.  A deus ex machina that might have worked in the 1980&#039;s as Ozymandius&#039; stalking horse, but not so much in 2009.

3.)  Some of the backstory on the earlier Masked Vigilanties.

4.  Yep.  That first fight was not physically possible with human beings (I say this as a second dan blackbelt).  Most (but not all) of the rest was more plausible than you might suspect.  If you want to see what real fighting looks like, I commend &lt;i&gt;Taken&lt;/i&gt; to you, while warning you that unless you have been trained, you will not be able to follow most of what happens.  Similarly, one of the survivors of the Hindenberg dropped from 60 feet in the air and walked away (he later was found to have broken one heel).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>garrett,</p>
<p>1.  RE the Graphic Violence: That was Rorschach&#8217;s defining moment.  He (correctly) concluded that that perpetrator would indeed be found &#8220;insane&#8221; by the &#8220;criminal justice&#8221; system, and treated vice punished.  Rorschach deemed that punishment was the appropriate outcome, and provided same.  He made his choice, and then consistently stuck with it; judging those he encountered on their own merits and faults, thus the antithesis of Ozymandius.</p>
<p>2.  In RE Dr. Manhattan&#8217;s package: Do you concur with my notice of the missing testicles and their symbology?</p>
<p>3.  What didn&#8217;t make the Movie (all y&#8217;all please chime in):</p>
<p>.1)  The <i>Black Freighter</i> Comic within the Graphic Novel (in which the protagonist becomes the evil he sought to overcome).</p>
<p>.2)  Mind Bending Squid from Outer Space.  A deus ex machina that might have worked in the 1980&#8242;s as Ozymandius&#8217; stalking horse, but not so much in 2009.</p>
<p>3.)  Some of the backstory on the earlier Masked Vigilanties.</p>
<p>4.  Yep.  That first fight was not physically possible with human beings (I say this as a second dan blackbelt).  Most (but not all) of the rest was more plausible than you might suspect.  If you want to see what real fighting looks like, I commend <i>Taken</i> to you, while warning you that unless you have been trained, you will not be able to follow most of what happens.  Similarly, one of the survivors of the Hindenberg dropped from 60 feet in the air and walked away (he later was found to have broken one heel).</p>
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		<title>By: garrett</title>
		<link>http://whatever.scalzi.com/2009/03/09/quick-watchmen-review/#comment-134163</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[garrett]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Mar 2009 03:56:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://whatever.scalzi.com/?p=6568#comment-134163</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ok, thanks to instapundit, I found this review.  I wanted to contribute.

First, I love comic books but never read watchmen.

My wife never read comic books.

We both loved the movie.

I did not think that it dragged on too much.  I did not find the gore too much most of the time.  The time rorschack chopped into that dude&#039;s head was too gratuitous.  I did not mind seeing the first chop (could have done without it) but seeing the second was over the top.  I would have preferred to see the cleaver come down, cut to silhouette and then cut back to see that the cleaver was indeed in the dudes head.  

Dr. Manhattan was a light suit, we are the weirdos that stay and read the credits.  His mouth did look odd.

I did not mind the penis.  I was not expecting it (again, I never read it).  But I did find my self saying very quickly, in the scene where manhattan in alone on mars and he is levitating with his legs folded &quot;indian style&quot;.  I said to my self, &quot;oh please no anus!  Please no anus!&quot;  Because that, frankly, would have been too much.

Ok, now i need some help.  Can someone point me to a place that tells me, definatively, the stuff that did not make it into the movie?  

Also, I read that the &quot;heroes&quot; do not really have any superpowers, they are just normals.  This diappointed me.  But, I also heard that they made the movie very much like the original material.  So this is what I noticed.  First, the comedian, at 67, swung, missed and knocked a block of his wall off, then someone punched thorugh the wall (ok, I could probably punch through drywall but it went clear through the other side).  Then OZY picked up the commedian the threw him further than those spaghetti arms could ever throw a baseball.  Twice Roarschak makes jumps that are cleary beyond human capabilities.  Owlman jumps out of the flying thing and lands on the ground - that would have killed a normal person.  In the fight scene with ozy where he catches a bullet (I get the impression that is not in the original material) roarscach and owl dude get thrown into stuff with enough force to kill a normal person.  Also, Roarschack is in antartica with only a hat and trenchcoat.  Now, if all of the above things are not examples of superpowers then please tell me of example normal people that I can compare these guys to.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok, thanks to instapundit, I found this review.  I wanted to contribute.</p>
<p>First, I love comic books but never read watchmen.</p>
<p>My wife never read comic books.</p>
<p>We both loved the movie.</p>
<p>I did not think that it dragged on too much.  I did not find the gore too much most of the time.  The time rorschack chopped into that dude&#8217;s head was too gratuitous.  I did not mind seeing the first chop (could have done without it) but seeing the second was over the top.  I would have preferred to see the cleaver come down, cut to silhouette and then cut back to see that the cleaver was indeed in the dudes head.  </p>
<p>Dr. Manhattan was a light suit, we are the weirdos that stay and read the credits.  His mouth did look odd.</p>
<p>I did not mind the penis.  I was not expecting it (again, I never read it).  But I did find my self saying very quickly, in the scene where manhattan in alone on mars and he is levitating with his legs folded &#8220;indian style&#8221;.  I said to my self, &#8220;oh please no anus!  Please no anus!&#8221;  Because that, frankly, would have been too much.</p>
<p>Ok, now i need some help.  Can someone point me to a place that tells me, definatively, the stuff that did not make it into the movie?  </p>
<p>Also, I read that the &#8220;heroes&#8221; do not really have any superpowers, they are just normals.  This diappointed me.  But, I also heard that they made the movie very much like the original material.  So this is what I noticed.  First, the comedian, at 67, swung, missed and knocked a block of his wall off, then someone punched thorugh the wall (ok, I could probably punch through drywall but it went clear through the other side).  Then OZY picked up the commedian the threw him further than those spaghetti arms could ever throw a baseball.  Twice Roarschak makes jumps that are cleary beyond human capabilities.  Owlman jumps out of the flying thing and lands on the ground &#8211; that would have killed a normal person.  In the fight scene with ozy where he catches a bullet (I get the impression that is not in the original material) roarscach and owl dude get thrown into stuff with enough force to kill a normal person.  Also, Roarschack is in antartica with only a hat and trenchcoat.  Now, if all of the above things are not examples of superpowers then please tell me of example normal people that I can compare these guys to.</p>
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